After losing three siblings at different stages of her life, Transformational Leadership Coach Mathilde Poirieux shares how grief, faith, and profound personal loss have shaped her spiritual journey and deepened her capacity to accompany others. In this heartfelt conversation, we explore the healing power of connection, the importance of inner work, and what it means to find light even in life's darkest moments.
What does it mean to remain open to life after experiencing profound loss? And how can our most challenging experiences become gateways to deeper connection, spiritual growth, and transformation?
In this episode of The Deep Coach Podcast, Jonathan Hermida sits down with Mathilde Poirieux, a Transformational Leadership Coach whose life and work embody a deep commitment to human evolution.
Growing up in a large family in France, Mathilde experienced the loss of two siblings during her childhood and a third in adulthood. These experiences profoundly shaped her relationship with faith, grief, and the deeper questions of human existence.
Rather than turning away from life's pain, Mathilde discovered the importance of learning to be present with it, a capacity that would eventually become central to her work as a coach.
Throughout their conversation, Jonathan and Mathilde explore how grief can transform our understanding of life, the significance of spiritual friendship, and the challenges and gifts of motherhood. Mathilde also shares her transition from corporate leadership development into coaching, her experience with the Deep Coaching Intensive, and how her practice has evolved to integrate retreats, reflection, and the healing potential of voice.
Their conversation ultimately returns to two themes that have shaped Mathilde's journey: evolution and connection.
In This Episode, You'll Discover
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🔗 Connect with Mathilde
Jonathan Hermida (00:00)
Matilda, it is so wonderful to have you here. It's this is a conversation we've been wanting to have for a while now, so it's a gift to finally have this opportunity together.
For those that that normally watch and listen, they know that I usually start with the question, who was Matilda prior to the onset of your transformational journey? But in so many ways, your transformational journey began from day one You come from a huge family of many siblings. And early on in your life, two of your siblings passed away. So one sibling passed away when you were two years old, and another sibling passed away when you were 12 years old.
do you remember anything of the the two year old when you were two years old when that sibling passed away?
Mathilde (00:45)
Yes, I have very i i I cannot say these are memories, but I I have feelings, like sorts of things I would sense about my very, very early childhood and especially when my mother got pregnant with my next brother, then I remembered. I and I know I remembered because it felt a bit insecure that the the baby w that
passed away when I was two, was born too early around just before six months. So so he lived a few hours and he passed away. But yeah, so w expecting another baby was very, very stressful for everyone. And I absolutely know that I was together with this you know, anxiety about keeping this next baby alive. Yeah.
Jonathan Hermida (01:39)
Yeah, yeah, I can imagine. Yeah, I can imagine also you feel the energy of the household, your mom, your your dad, your sibl other siblings, and there's a lot of that energy swirling around as well.
Mathilde (01:51)
Absolutely. And I remember like being close to my mom who was like keeping the bed for for the next baby and I I remember singing to her, like to with her and to her, I think. to, you know, be together. I I believe it was an active way to be with someone in a healing way, honestly. But yeah, that's something I know now that I didn't know before. Yeah.
Jonathan Hermida (02:17)
Yeah, yeah. And then you lost another sibling at the age of twelve, which obviously you're much more conscious, you're aware, you're a young adult.
Mathilde (02:24)
Yes.
Jonathan Hermida (02:24)
what how did that experience impact you?
Mathilde (02:28)
Yes. that was very impacting because this one passed away from leukemia. So that was a long, you know, process of disease and illness, hospital. it's very co very similar to cancer, as a process. and so she was yeah, she's been sick since since she she was three months old when she was diagnosed, and she passed away at fourteen months. So it was a whole year of
of like disease and I was 11 so I was like very very aware and this one was very I mean transformative in a way that I we were a faithful family so we were like really praying and hundreds of people were praying with us that was a huge immense movement to support us and we were feeling supported for sure.
but yeah, it impacted me in a way that I was very sure, very sure that she would recover, like as a miracle. I was absolutely sure. I was counting on the miracle. so it was a big shock when it didn't happen. and I absolutely questioned many things about about like fairness and God and prayer and why and
not being very angry, but being very, very disappointed. Yeah. And sad, obviously, yeah.
Jonathan Hermida (04:04)
Hm. How did
Yeah, of course. Of course. How did that then influence your relationship to religion, to prayer, to God afterwards?
Mathilde (04:15)
Yeah, I then I went on trying many things, but I stopped praying for things to happen for sure. and I stopped trusting people who sell miracles, definitely. so I became very aware of yeah, religious
power, let's say. So so anybody who would who would make you believe anything, I became very, very skeptical, in a way, really using my my mind to question many things. so that's a that's been a big thing. and with religion I I stayed like very faithful and religious but in a way that was more intuitive and less
Less following all the rules. yeah.
Jonathan Hermida (05:14)
Yeah. Yeah. You you grew up in a really large household with seven siblings and it wasn't just the tragedies, it was also the amount of people, the different personalities, the emotions. So what what was it like to experience that? Because also go going through those tragedies, I imagine it's not just your emotions, but your experiencing your siblings' emotions, your parents' emotions. What
Mathilde (05:36)
Yes.
Jonathan Hermida (05:37)
what was it like overall growing up in a household like that?
Mathilde (05:41)
yeah, I mean it was sometimes a bit chaotic. a lot of fun, a lot of noise, many conversations, discussions, all the time. it was quite a it is still like a household where we discuss a lot and we yeah, we disagree, we challenge each other, we laugh, we so a lot of like joy as well, of course. what sorrow brought was
quite a bit of of yeah cynical humor and like humor that we still share and that's still fun in a way. in
Jonathan Hermida (06:21)
Yeah.
Mathilde (06:23)
a way, in a way. and I I really I'm I'm the number four in in seven. So I I was in the middle all the time and looking at people and trying to understand how how is it possible we are so different.
so different, each of us. And I think from the quite early on I was interested in looking at people and observing and yeah, I mean trying to understand how people think and why we're so different. Yeah. Yeah. I
Jonathan Hermida (06:54)
Mm.
Mathilde (06:55)
loved it. Yeah. We're still very close as a sibling group, yeah.
Jonathan Hermida (07:01)
Yeah. Yeah. It it's incredible to have so many. And I I imagine you all raised each other in some regard because once you have so many, you know, it's hard for the parents to be the sole influences there. Everybody's sort of influencing
Mathilde (07:11)
Yes, yep.
Jonathan Hermida (07:13)
the the unfolding and the older ones are bringing in stories from school and you know, the outside world and all that stuff.
Mathilde (07:20)
absolutely.
Jonathan Hermida (07:22)
Yeah. Funny 'cause my
Well, not funny, but funny in the same way. my siblings and I have a lot of dark humor. We relate around a lot of dark humor with my mom's passing and it is a way of healing and and sort of making sense and connecting, post tragedy, you know.
Mathilde (07:36)
Absolutely. Yes,
yes. And it's within a very special circle that it's possible, yeah.
Jonathan Hermida (07:44)
exactly, exactly. Close knit. at thirty four, then you another sibling passes and so you have you're really experiencing quite a bit of loss in your life related to your core family.
that point where w I'm and I can only imagine, and also not imagine what that must be like where you're questioning everything and life and God and even more so, like how is there another sibling
What what was then that experience like at thirty four when you lost another
Mathilde (08:10)
Yeah.
Jonathan Hermida (08:11)
sibling?
Mathilde (08:13)
it was very shocking. Very, very shocking. especially because it was a a car accident. and two of my brothers were together and one passed and one survived. And so it's been very, very challenging and difficult in many ways and obviously like very challenging for the survivor as well. being like grieving with us and in a different way as well. so it was very shocking and very
tragic. My brother who passed away was just 40. so very young, a young father as well of four children. And yeah, it was a very different kind of grief actually with the shock that I I didn't experience before. and at this point in life I had a different role in the family. I was more I was still in the middle for sure. the
Brother who passed away with the the elder one. So that shook everything for us. because he was quite a quite a pillar in our family. So so the sorrow and the grief went on for years. and it's still present, but we've travelled and journeyed and and transformed in a way in each person in their own way, and we've accompanied each other quite a bit.
as well. Yeah. It's been it's been
now, yeah, a number of years, like fourteen years, yeah, but yeah. Like so I would say shocking. and in a way, in a very weird way, it was a bit I could I can say it was life affirming as well. Cause I I already had my life trajectory. I I was a mother as well. I
had discussed with my this brother about becoming c a coach and I had told him about this new thing I wanted to do and yeah and I did it. you know, I continued on the journey that I was on and feeling very encouraged actually by him all the way. Since now still now, definitely encouraged by him. Yeah.
Jonathan Hermida (10:39)
Hmm. Yeah, incredible. What what have you learned about loss and grief, healing as a result of all the experiences that you've had in your life?
Mathilde (10:53)
a lot. I've I've learned I mean I think the first thing I've learned very early on is that death is part of life. Yeah, it's always been present for me, in some way. So I'm usually very okay to to talk about death and grief and sorrow and pain. I'm familiar with it in a way. and I also discovered
When I was rather young, that many people are not okay to discuss that. Yeah. So so yeah, it it looks weird or strange or obviously frightening for for many people. yeah, so now I mean in my work as well, but i in in general when my friends lose l I mean a love a loved one, they
They know that I I I can be here and I can be present. I am I'm okay to be here with that. and I know I I never know in their place, but I I have some clue of how it hurts, yeah. Yeah, and how you're still alive after that as well.
Jonathan Hermida (12:11)
can you explain more on that?
Mathilde (12:14)
Well, there is a a saying like when you when you when you when you have these kind of griefs that are white quite different, like it's not an old person going, but it's a sibling or it's a young person going. Many people have different sentences about that. And one of them we heard so many times is that, life goes on. Okay, life goes on. And people dare to say that, which is not always nice to hear.
and in a way it's true. It's really true. That I remember really not liking to hear that, but thinking, in a way it's true. Yeah, because I'm yeah, I'm surviving to them and I'm here anyway. So life goes on. It feels different, it tastes everything tastes different and feel different and looks different. and in a way life continues. yeah.
Jonathan Hermida (13:14)
Yeah. No, it's true. It is true. I've experienced losing a friend to suicide, different family members passing, my mom, of course. and young kids, like friends, children and and things like that that are horrible and tragic and and it i it is interesting because life does move on, but you are forever transformed as a result of it and impacted as a result of it. And so it goes on but it's different at the same time.
Mathilde (13:40)
Absolutely. Absolutely. And I've also learned very early on that different people have different ways to experience grief. you know, 'cause I witnessed like firsthand my parents and my siblings in very different ways according to their personality and their age and whatever, I don't know. and it's like there are hundreds of ways to actually experience or like avoid to feel. It's one way to experience it as well. And I've
I've seen a lot of that, yeah.
Jonathan Hermida (14:13)
Yeah, it's so true. It's very true. Same thing happened with my siblings. when you began or you continued your healing journey, when did it extend beyond the Catholic Church? What were some of those
Mathilde (14:23)
Yeah.
Jonathan Hermida (14:24)
early additional outlets that you began looking into?
Mathilde (14:33)
I think in a way it began with travelling, when I discovered things outside of Europe Europe.
And especially since I've lived in Asia since two ten now. I I'm based in Hong Kong. and I discovered many different religions and spiritualities and traditions where actually I mean in Hong Kong there are actually many people who like don't really believe in things but they still have practices, which was very new to me. Like, how can you have like
practices and everyday practices without having faith in any any anything spiritual that's was very new to me. and I traveled quite a bit around Asia and seeing very different ways to yeah different religions at first that's what I saw but then I made friends and this is what made me realize how spirituality is.
totally universal that I absolutely I I don't even believe that I see that. and I have very dear friends who have different faith and and not necessarily are from a religion but who I share a very strong sense of the same spirit spirituality. because in the end everything is converging towards love and that's what I absolutely
see and experience now, yeah.
Jonathan Hermida (16:15)
In all the religions and all the different forms of spirituality, that everything is converging into love ultimately. Yeah.
Mathilde (16:22)
Yeah. Yes. Yeah.
Jonathan Hermida (16:25)
Yeah. What role has has you mentioned friends, what role have friends played in your life and spiritual partnerships as well, as you
Mathilde (16:34)
Yeah.
Jonathan Hermida (16:35)
continued your journey?
Mathilde (16:38)
Yes. that makes me smile.
Jonathan Hermida (16:41)
Ha ha.
Mathilde (16:42)
that friends have a a a key a key role in my life. and I remember a big breakthrough breakthrough conversation with a friend who I I just discussed with today actually. and she helped me to articulate something that I couldn't articulate before and it was the first time I experienced actually
it was a sort of coaching and and the joy of finding this clarity thanks to her asking me questions and being here for me. And I remember telling telling her, but I was not aware of that. How can I say that? And and being so joyful, and thankful for her presence in like for her
insistence in asking me questions because she felt it was important for me to say it. yeah, and so yeah, I have several very very close friends and when I discovered this when I took the Deep Coaching Intensive that the DC the DCI that you took as well, I discovered this concept of spiritual partnering.
Jonathan Hermida (18:02)
Yeah.
Mathilde (18:04)
And I I I read through what it describes and and then I realised, my god, that's what I mean by friendship. That's exactly what I mean. Like we are responsible for each other's source in a way. And you know, it's a real big thing. But it's this, yeah.
Jonathan Hermida (18:27)
Hmm. Yeah, you you mentioned responsible for each other's souls. But I think it extends beyond responsibility. it is a a true connection of two beings, two souls coming together. in a sense, a choiceless choice. A choiceless choice
that that has so much to do with grace in terms of
who we attract, why we attract them, how we come together, how we uplift each other. it's really an extraordinary process when two souls come together in that way, for the purposes of uplifting each other. it's really beautiful.
Mathilde (18:59)
absolutely, absolutely.
Jonathan Hermida (19:04)
Yeah. What what was it like to become a mother for the first time?
Mathilde (19:11)
my god, no, it's the biggest adventure. I love adventure. I that's the reason why we came to live in Asia because we wanted adventure in our life. But my god, being a mother is the biggest adventure. And I'm so glad. yeah, I was like gifted with four children. it's it it came very like as
As a gift, I became a mother without like thinking too much and without preparing myself at all. It felt very natural for me because I've always been around kids all the time. So I knew quite a lot about how to actually take care of a a a a very young baby. I I knew this and I've been with many nephews and nieces. It was very natural. But when it was my own, my God. That felt very different.
And especially how how responsible I felt and how anxious I became actually on making things wrong and yeah, I had absolutely not anticipated how anxious anxious it would make me, because I wanted to do well. and I I know now that I've always had very high standards about what kind of mother I wanted to be, and I was
always comparing myself with these high standards I was putting for myself and it's added to the anxiety actually but yeah so a lot of like anxiety of course immense joys and a lot of learning and still still now of course like my older kid now is my daughter is 22 so our children are 22 to 13
So it's still quite a handful and in many many ways we are needed, you know. in many d different ways. Yeah.
it evolved. It evolved and because I'm so I'm quite quite perceptive about people personalities and preferences and emotions and then I could tell quite early on that my second child had had different needs and the third child different as well and I so I tried to adapt, which I did a lot. so I learned a lot.
but then no it didn't really help with the anxiety. Yeah. Yeah, adding adding to it up to a point where it was enough and I started to get sick.
Jonathan Hermida (22:07)
Mm.
Mathilde (22:08)
after the the year after having my our third child, I got sick all the time and I was over tired actually and I think stressed out.
Yeah, it became a bit serious, like with a lot of infections like all the time and so I had like surgeries in my sinuses to to try to harp. It was painful and I was feeling awful. but then it was the moment where I probably hit the bottom physically and we it's the same year we moved in Hong Kong.
actually and then
Jonathan Hermida (22:50)
Mm.
Mathilde (22:51)
I absolutely changed the way I live. got more help with the children and I had to relax because I had no choice. Like I knew I had to relax and yeah, manage differently. Yeah. Trust other people to help me, which I had a hard time to do with.
Jonathan Hermida (23:14)
So by the fourth, would it be fair to say that you were a completely different parent compared to the first at least definitely the first two?
Mathilde (23:19)
yes.
yes. Yes. Yeah. Absolutely. Yes. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Definitely more more relaxed and more in a way more present. yes. and I started my coach training the same year he was born. Actually I was pregnant when I started and it yeah I I already ha had started to shift quite a bit. Yeah.
Jonathan Hermida (23:45)
So what would you say you lost yourself a little bit with your kids and then there was a sort of remembering that I need to take care of myself and that was another sort of transformative moment for you?
Mathilde (23:56)
I would, yeah, definitely. My body like yeah, my body said it was enough. Yes, absolutely. Yeah.
Jonathan Hermida (24:03)
Yeah. And and what was it about coaching that drew you as a profession?
Mathilde (24:11)
I I had met a few coaches in my work. Like I I used to work at at a big big corporate in learning and development and I had met many like trainers and coaches and two particular coaches I met made me think a lot about it and thinking like hey I one day I'll do that.
Even though someone told me I had not enough charisma to do it. I'm glad I didn't listen to them. But I when I arrived in Hong Kong, I was in charge of the hypotential program in in my like company. And the way we did it
It was it was a good program, but it was not about leadership. It was I think it was really preparing people as clones. Like in a way. Like everybody received the same thing. And I remember going to my boss and saying, well, at this level of career, we absolutely need to like help people to discover what kind of leader they are. and I was rather young. I was 30, but I was very passionate with my work and I
I think I kind of really knew what kind of conversations I wanted to have with them that were not happening and it was very frustrating. So I went to my boss again and convinced her that I need to get a a coach training because I want to do it. Yeah, and that's how I went.
Jonathan Hermida (25:53)
what were the conversations you were trying to have that you didn't feel you could have?
Mathilde (26:00)
It was really about asking people, hey, what kind of leader do you want to be? Because the company wants you to do this and that and to act this way. And there are I mean, there was actually a list of expected behaviors as a leader, but it was only behaviors. And I was really keen to hear what was behind for them. What does it mean for them? What are the values, the beliefs that actually
sustain your leadership so that you become I mean the leader you want to be instead of copying your boss or copying or if avoiding to be like someone else that you didn't enjoy having as a boss. and I could see so many of these things happening that yeah I was very keen to at least have try to help the the the twenty leaders that was that were in this program was I was in charge of to
actually start on this journey. I didn't know it was a journey at this at this point, but yeah, I think intuitively I I was attracted to that. Yeah.
Jonathan Hermida (27:11)
Hm. And what did you sense from the leaders in terms of their openness to those conversations?
Mathilde (27:19)
Well, yeah, that's a really good question. not much at the time. Not much.
I think they were kind of really stuck in their managerial stance, let's say that I need to manage this and manage these people, manage my clients, etc. But now I would call it managing, not leadership. because leadership needs to come from your leadership would come from your gut, from your mind, from your heart, from everywhere in your being. And
Yeah, there was not much opening and actually after I actually progressed in my coach training and I started to try to move this move things internally, it didn't work out. yeah. But I I was okay because I had started coaching outside, because it was part of my coach training, so and I there was a bit of a word of mouth going on and I was okay to go and the word of mouth continued for years. So yeah, so I left.
Yeah, for to coach people who were ready for the work.
Jonathan Hermida (28:32)
what was it like to transition from a a corporation into business ownership?
Mathilde (28:38)
It was very unexpected. I absolutely had no clue I would ever do that. but in a way it was very natural. Like it it's really emerged very organically actually that I started coaching a few neighbors and their their friends and then their bigger circles and and I came with a full practice within less than
Less than two years actually, so so I didn't have to ask myself any question. started
Jonathan Hermida (29:14)
Yeah.
Mathilde (29:15)
to to earn a bit of money and to reimburse my coach training fees and I remember this day when I earned, you know, back but I had invested and I thought, okay. that's I mean I didn't have to think about it at all. Okay, good. Let's follow on. Yeah. I would never have thought it would be
So it's possible that it's so easy. Yeah. I've been very lucky.
Jonathan Hermida (29:39)
Hmm. What what
were some of the keys what were some of the keys that helped you? So if there's a a coach listening to this, someone who's trying to build their own practice, what were some of the things that really helped you to sort of hit the ground running in a sense?
Mathilde (29:56)
enthusiasm. I love what I do and it shows. And when I talk about it, people are attracted to know more. usually. So I just went out to, you know, some some Chamber of Commerce talk or any anything like every every two months I challenge myself to
go out and talk with people and every time I met people who were interested. so yeah for me as long as I have done that it was very organically alive, let's say. and then COVID broke this circle in a way that I had to reinvent other ways to do. But yeah, but I mean enthusiasm and being very spontaneous about offering coaching.
Yeah. Because people would be attracted.
Jonathan Hermida (30:56)
Yeah. You mentioned COVID. You were doing a lot you you're doing mostly in person coaching at the time prior to COVID, right? Yeah. So
Mathilde (31:03)
Yes,
Jonathan Hermida (31:05)
what was the experience of COVID and how did it impact your business? How did you move on from that?
Mathilde (31:14)
well I mean in the first year of COVID all the current assignments continued online and it was different but in a way we made it work and I've I I had already worked online with clients like every summer when we fly to France I would coach people online so I knew I knew it worked and I had done this before. what
was so the online thing was okay actually. What's happened after that it was silence and a very, very quiet business where you know all the companies were coping and managing and every everyone was coping. in Hong Kong COVID lasted three years. like the kids had masks every day at school when school was open for three years. Yeah.
so it was long. that was really long. Yeah, but I mean, everything evolved in a way. and I still have some of my coaching face to face and some online and I appreciate you have both. It's fun.
Jonathan Hermida (32:29)
Yeah. During that time you went through the Deep Coaching Intensive. And for those that don't know, that's the program that we offer here at the Center for Transformational Coaching. And and so you were in that experience. tell me a little bit about your experience with the Deep Coaching Intensive? How did it impact your journey, your coaching, you know, what the work that you're doing today?
Mathilde (32:48)
Yes. Well it was very transformative. I in two nineteen I went to a coaching conference in Mumbai, India. And that's where I met Leon Van der Poor and Amrita Singh, both very dear friend now. And we had met with Amrita just in the day and we heard Leon talk about deep coaching. But not only we heard him talk but we saw what it did.
to a whole r a room full of it was a hundred coaches on this workshop on that day. And people were so touched that it was only talking and talking about love and hugging after after just half half an hour of of Leon telling about how he works. so that was quite an experience and
And there I read Leon's book, like A Shift in Being, and I felt so much at home. I felt really that I have found what I was looking for. which was a way to coach that goes as deep as people are ready to go, like deep into at at the core of their being, but also deep into their pain. And because I am familiar with pain, I
I know we cannot coach around it. It's it doesn't work. But I didn't know before taking the deep coaching intensive, I didn't know I didn't dare, let's say probably, or I didn't feel confident in accompanying people into exploring the depth of their being, including their pain and whatever is burdening them that much.
And so DCI gave me tools and a an approach that helped me very confidently telling people, hey, I know it's dark, I know it's scary, and I'm here and I will accompany you wherever you're going. we can do it together. so that was the biggest shift in my in my practice as a coach, like to actually dare to
accompany people where they are ready to go. And of course it's not only the paint, but also the beauties and the the boldness
Jonathan Hermida (35:16)
Mm.
Mathilde (35:16)
and whatever is ready to emerge.
Jonathan Hermida (35:19)
Mm-hmm.
Mathilde (35:20)
but also feeling equipped to do that. And because I I like a work that's well done. I don't like I yeah, I want to be be really fully present for people and not not just trying.
'Cause it's really worthwhile to be fully present, yeah.
Jonathan Hermida (35:43)
Yes. Yes. what have you noticed are the characteristics of somebody who's ready to go, as you say?
Mathilde (35:51)
Ready to go for this deep wake, you mean?
Jonathan Hermida (35:53)
Yes, yes.
Mathilde (35:55)
Yes. they're asking themselves so many questions, feeling very lost, usually. and what I'm noticing that many people say that these questions are new. they've had c transitions before, but this time it feels different. and I offer I offer leadership coaching and and tr career transition coaching and some
Some people come and say, like, I'd like to figure this out, and it feels light. And some people say, I have no idea, and this time it's scary. And that would be a sign that it's way more than a career shift they're going for. yeah, so feeling lost, asking a lot of questions, and and the kind of questions usually touch to beliefs.
And not recognizing what
I mean being being very challenged about what they believe in anymore and who they are anymore. so this question about like I'm not sure of myself or I'm not sure what I'm meant to to do, w in the end, what's the meaning, all these questions, like the deeper questions come in. Yeah.
Jonathan Hermida (37:21)
Hmm. Hmm. And it's a journey you're very familiar with. you're somebody who continues to invest in yourself in so many ways. you shared with me that over a 10 year period you committed yourself to doing one retreat a year. I don't know if that's still going, but what has been your motivation in seeking those spaces out during this time?
Mathilde (37:43)
Yes, I the motivation at first it was survival, to be very frank. It was really like discovering that I need time for myself, but I need it badly. Because being a mother of four and someone who accompanies people as a as a work, it's giving all the time and all the time. And being a a friend and a daughter and a a sister, it was very
generous but also taxing. So so the first retreat retreat I ever did was like the purpose was to relax, like learn to relax. And I went to this yoga retreat, being very stressed out of leaving my kids and not, you know, not sure how I would even manage to relax every any minute of it. not only I came back relaxed, but I came back with an
immense sense of something new that actually have taking s I mean offering space to myself was very transformative in a way in the way I I live and in the way I work. And I had not decided to do once a a a year at first but it came like that and now it's very intentional because I know I need this space.
And not only I do that every year, but also I have a day every week where it's a retreat day as well. and again it started as a survival thing. I thought, once a month I'll take a Tuesday off. It started like this and it be it became every fortnight and then every week, first as a survival, honestly, but then as a way to live. And that's a day where I can be and I plan nothing.
And I just am and I go with the flow and that's yeah, that's absolutely part of my life now.
Jonathan Hermida (39:47)
Yeah. Is that a day that you fill with certain practices, or you're really it's just nothing and you get to just meander and and just be and and flow?
Mathilde (39:58)
Yeah, both. the only rule is that I schedule nothing on Tuesdays. Yeah, that's the one rule. so I have the whole day and I aim to be back home at four to see my youngest youngest son back from school. So it's the day where I'm back early and that's fun for him as well. so n no no rule and no shoulds at all.
Which means that there are practices but nothing is forced and it's really flowy. but what I'm noticing is that it's it most of the time has reading, journaling, yoga, and time in nature, which is very for me very, very conducive to to being. Yeah.
Jonathan Hermida (41:00)
It's really wonderful. It's really wonderful because you're you're continuing to grow and evolve. And speaking about growing and evolving, your even your work is continuing to evolve. those listening probably have not heard you sing, but you have one of the most magnificent voices out there. You you you took us through some practices during the most recent retreat in Portugal, which was so beautiful, so wonderful. And
you are leaning further into that. Is that right? You're leaning into more voice kind of work.
Mathilde (41:32)
Yeah.
Jonathan Hermida (41:33)
Can you share a little more about what that looks like?
Mathilde (41:36)
Yeah, yes, yeah, thank you. That makes me smile, absolutely.
I've I mean singing has been a part of my spiritual practice like forever. Actually I think it's my entry door to spirituality and and and prayer. and since I've been interested in in healing, I've contemplated the the contemplated this idea of using voice as a healing modality.
And I away again didn't know that it existed but obviously it does. And I discovered it through just experience and you know, singing to someone some time and and the them receiving something and and me, you know, there is a very strong sense of knowing that it's not from me. but I through singing I'm transmitting God's love. I that's how
How I would put it. it's it's a way. It's a way to help people receive. and I've had several recent experiences with that and and now I yeah, with this experience we had together in Portugal, that made me think about offering this more, just
Helping people to actually use their voice so that they give presents and they give love to others in ways that at first like people usually say, I can't sing, I cannot do that, but it's not about singing, it's about voice and energy, actually. It's nothing about singing. so so it's very organic in a way that I'm discovering as I'm going, but I recently have been more.
intentional about working towards offering retreats where i would yeah hold space for people. I I have two projects at at the moment one retreat for leaders that will be in front this one and I'm co-hosting this with a person who uses voice and I
as as therapy and we are combining his approach to voice and my approach to coaching and especially coaching leaders to help them discover who they are and so we are combining this discover your voice and discover yourself as a leader together so that they work on their presence actually over a few days. So that will be an offering in the coming year.
one in France and one in Hong Kong and both in French. So that's a big adventure. I'm very excited about that. and another retreat that I want to offer to coaches in Hong Kong because Hong Kong is a busy city. Very busy and people are exhausted and coaches what I've realized is that n many coaches don't have a reflective practice and they don't take the time to
Just to breathe, to reflect, and obviously not not necessarily to heal either. so I've been trying to offer a coaching supervision for several years, and I'm noticing people are not taking the time because we're so busy, and I'm hoping that when you know they're invited in in a two-day retreat, they can actually experience the slowing down, breathing.
getting back
Jonathan Hermida (45:32)
Yeah.
Mathilde (45:33)
to themselves and go back to the world. Yeah, with more energy. Yeah.
Jonathan Hermida (45:39)
Yeah, it feels counterintuitive, especially for those busy professionals, to take time off to focus on oneself and work on these
Mathilde (45:46)
Yes.
Jonathan Hermida (45:46)
things. But it's for anybody that has experienced it, it is the most significant determiner of optimal performance. And I don't even think that should be the focus, but you end up performing so much better.
in your work, in your life, there's more spaciousness, there's more patience, there's more curiosity when you're able to slow down. And as a result of that, better ideas, better energy to execute on those ideas. and so I recommend every single person take time off where and when they can to really focus on themselves, do the inner work,
get whatever is in the way out of the way so that they liberate that latent energy that we all have and that goes undervalued, under expressed as a result of life's patterns, the patterns that we have entrenched, in our day-to-day life.
Mathilde (46:42)
Absolutely. I absolutely believe that slowing down just enables high access to our our higher intelligence.
Jonathan Hermida (46:51)
Yes.
Mathilde (46:51)
and so it goes way beyond performance actually. Because you can have a hundred ideas
Jonathan Hermida (46:55)
Yes, yes.
Mathilde (46:58)
like that are performant and you can have one huge,
Jonathan Hermida (47:00)
Yeah.
Mathilde (47:01)
huge idea actually that's beyond an idea that's a life giving new energy that will
Jonathan Hermida (47:08)
Yeah. Life changing.
Yeah. Yeah.
Mathilde (47:11)
Yes, exactly. Yeah.
Jonathan Hermida (47:15)
Yeah, it's great. the world is where it's at. it's a complex difficult time in this moment. What do you what kind of leader do you think the world needs right now? This is borrowing a question that you often use.
Mathilde (47:30)
Yes, I love asking this question to people these days. I believe the world needs leaders who are
I mean I I I don't know a better word, but evolutionary leader, which means that they are always connected to themselves in a way that it's ever evolving. someone who knows them n know themselves really well and they also know that they are becoming someone like all the time.
Jonathan Hermida (48:12)
Mm.
Mathilde (48:14)
I I met a leader I admire a lot and I asked him this question and he answered this like knowing how to become as the biggest knowledge and I loved it. It's like yeah, exactly, exactly. So a leader who would own their place, of course, and they would own their place not because they like power at all, but because they know that within themselves is
some power that can be useful and it can shine in a way that is bringing the world to a better place. Yeah. Yeah.
Jonathan Hermida (48:54)
Mm.
Hmm. Well, you are a leader that is bringing the world to a better place. There's no doubt about that. is there anything that we haven't discussed, anything that hasn't been navigated here that would be helpful to share or bring up before we begin closing today's recording?
Mathilde (49:11)
Hmm. Thank you. and in no way you know this is scripted or or planned. So like we cover what what comes today. one thing that came to me when I was reflecting about today, I realised there are key things in my life that actually we covered already. Just want to name them. One is evolution that we've like I think pronounced like a a dozen times already.
I I'm very eager to contribute to evolution. Like in a way, I think as human beings we are evolving all the time and that's very a a very natural process. And in a way we can contribute to this evolution, like we can you know work with the flow to help the flow. And I I believe that's what I am doing with my work and with my life.
And the other theme that actually very contributing to that is connection. Like everything is about connection and how like where we come from, from our family, family is connection. yeah, for the good and the bad about it and and like it is ultimate connection, friendship, spiritual partnering, coaching, retreat time, what we what we share.
in this community of a beautiful community we share about for for deep coaching and evolutionary leaders. Everything is connection. It's connection connecting together, connecting to ourselves of course, and connecting to the divine part within us. Yeah. All comes back to
Jonathan Hermida (50:57)
Yeah.
Mathilde (50:57)
that.
Jonathan Hermida (50:58)
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. It's so it's so true. And I really think that anybody, regardless of if they're on a conscious spiritual path or not, what they're ultimately looking for, every single human being on this in this world is connection, that feeling of connection. The connection to themselves, connection to others, connection to something greater than themselves. and that is what folks are most feeling disconnected from, in fact.
And I think that is what ails us as a society right now, deep feelings of disconnection from their fellow human, from themselves, from the world around them. And
Mathilde (51:32)
Yes.
Jonathan Hermida (51:33)
the way we heal is to r help folks reconnect, reconnect to that inner truth, that inner self, that which connects us all ultimately.
Mathilde (51:42)
Hmm, yes.
Jonathan Hermida (51:49)
Yeah. Matilda, as we as we wrap up here, for somebody that's listening that's on their own transformational journey, maybe they're going through you know, their own dark night of the soul, their own grief process. What what can you share with them that might help them navigate their journey today?
Mathilde (52:06)
Yes. What's coming now to me is a sentence someone told me that actually I think saved my life at some point. when I was like deep down in grief. it was a priest actually. I'm very grateful to him. Like he said, there is always a light. Like in the darkest places there is always a light. Yeah. And and that's what I want to
to offer today. I am hearing many people who are losing hope in France, in Europe and everywhere in the world. there is a lot of like despair and anxiety. and I've you know like people close to me are very anxious and I am so it's not even that I'm convinced but it's I know and I experience this light now every day.
and then because I experience it, I I really want to invite people to look inside and know there is a light, because there is.
Jonathan Hermida (53:17)
There is. There is. And that's what we need to remind folks of because you're right, it can feel really dark right now. For many people it feels dark. It feels hopeless. It feels like, nobody's looking out for them. You mentioned France, of course, the riots there, the elections are today and we're recording on November third in the United States and there's a lot of anger on all sides. And we're just living in this really difficult time, and so if we each can be a light
a light onto this world. This is how people can then see themselves as a mirror to what we're reflecting back. they can see themselves and they can see what's possible, and that is the work that needs to be done here ultimately. So, you know, I wanna thank you for being that light for so many and for showing up so brilliantly all the time. It it really is a gift to know you. I feel grateful that
you get to show up in the way you do for for not just the center, but for your family, for for your clients, for everybody that is around you, because you are truly somebody who if anybody stayed to watch this whole conversation, you know Matilda's a real deal. You've gone through it, and you've come out the other side stronger, brighter, and wiser as a result. So thank you. Thank you, Matilda, for sharing so much of you with us here today.
Mathilde (54:35)
Thank you so much, Jonathan. I loved like being in presence together. It's a true gift. Thank you.
Jonathan Hermida (54:43)
Yeah, you're welcome. Thank you.